Nissan Titan Secret Shopper
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Nissan Titan Secret Shopper - 12/11/2005 1:09:56 AM
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sandiegohemi
Posts: 411
Joined: 5/23/2005
From: San Diego, CA
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As you can tell, I own a Dodge Ram Hemi, and I love it. But with all the posts and trash talking Titan owners do, I felt the need to see one of these trucks in person. I went in with an open mind and tried to be as objective as possible.
I looked at a 2006 Titan 4wd SE Extended Cab. My overall impression of the exterior appearance: decent, but cheap materials. One example is the rear bumper. It is flimsy compared to a Dodge, Ford, or Chevy. If you noticed the lights on the bumper - that illuminate your license plate - the Titan has cheap chrome colored plastic with Christmas light sized bulbs. This is not a big deal, but it indicates a theme throughout the truck. I will give them this, they did a great job with the tailgate assist. It is extremely easy to open - unlike my Dodge - and the cargo track and spray in liner were nice. Again, this wouldn't make me buy the truck, but were nice additions. This leads to my second impression. If I was to buy a Titan (this one priced at $31,000), I'd want to make sure my door handles did not wobble around when I opened the door. This particular Titan had 200 miles on it, so I was surprised the door handles were this weakend after only 200 miles. Again, not a big deal, but a new truck shouldn't do this (My 2004 Ram feels just as sturdy as the day I bought it). Enough about the exterior, you guys get the point.
As for the interior, not bad for an import but still far below the domestics. The plastics are cheap and flimsy on the doors, dash, center console and overhead bins. What stuck out were the handles on the front pillars. I tugged on the driver side to feel its sturdiness and it started to pull off (good thing the Nissan sales rep didn't see it!). The seats felt cheap as well, the arm support bars wobbled back and forth on passenger and driver side. Plus, I'm not a big fan of the neoprene style seats. In my opinion, the new F150 has the best seats, but the Titan is near the bottom. The overhead digital readout screen lacked standard information I have on my Dodge. For example, it tells you the outside temperature and direction, but nothing more . . . no mpg estimate (like my Dodge), no timer (like my Dodge), no dimming feature (like my Dodge), etc. The instrument cluster wasn't laid out properly. The traction control and differential locker were located at the base of the center console - hard to reach. The chrome "Nissan" logo on the steering wheel had lost it's "chrome painted" surface (another surprise after only 200 miles). Don't get me started on the center console. The plastics were cheap, the grip on the cup holders rubbed off with little effort, and everytime I pulled a latch, I felt like I was going to break something. What did I like about the Titan interior? The rear seats fold in a way to allow maximum loading (they fold like a Ram so you can load the bottom) and the rear doors opened all the way.
Now for the fun part . . . the test drive. With all the trash talking I hear from Titan owners, I was prepared for a Formula 1 car engine under the hood. Not quite. I would rate the engine and transmission better than a Ford, Chevy, or Toyota, but slightly below a Dodge. One noticable differece, there is a lag in the Titan between mashing on the gas pedal and the power kicking in. It felt like the truck was driving me, not me driving the truck. I would compare it to driving a Nissan Maxima or Honda Accord, instead of a truck. Don't get me wrong, it is quick, but it does not feel as powerful as a Hemi. You fellow Hemi owners know what I'm talking about - that feeling when you stomp on the gas pedal and hold on for dear life. Plus, I don't care what "automotive expert" says about acceleration, a Quad Cab Hemi will keep up with this Titan anyday of the week. I knew this from experience (racing stoplight to stoplight or on the freeway), but this test drive confirmed it. Compared to my Hemi Ram, the Titan is quicker 0-30, but 30-60+ the Hemi has it beat.
My overall impression is this - a Titan is NOT the worst truck out there, but it is not the "challenge to the Big 3" that some people say. See, if we are comparing powertrains, then yes it is a challenge - it blows away a Ford or Chevy, but I'll put it up against a Dodge anytime. IF we are comparing overall driving impression and quality, then it fails miserably against the domestics. The Titans materials are cheap, flimsy in some spots, embarassing in others. I don't mean to sound biased, but I expected more from this truck. To me, it seemed Nissan put the emphasis on the engine and transmission, threw a few gadgets at it (box behind rear fender, cargo rack, and bed liner) and put it on the market. I did not feel refinement, attention to detail, and durability truck owners demand. Maybe this is confirmed by the fact Nissan still hasn't reached its original goal of selling 100,000 a year.
Well, sorry to ramble, but thought you guys might like an honest impression from a Ram owner. Overall, it confirmed what I thought . . . the Dodge Ram Hemi is the right truck, in size, in power, in quality, in ruggedness, and in proven track record. I would encourage you guys to go to a Nissan dealer and do the same thing. You'll be happy you own a Dodge.
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RE: Nissan Titan Secret Shopper - 12/11/2005 4:21:36 AM
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DevilsReject
Toys For Tots Fund Contributor
Posts: 7976
Joined: 7/29/2005
From: Indianapolis, Indiana a.k.a Hell
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That's a very informative opinion. I think the Titan has the potential to give the Ram its best competition in a couple years. You had to understand that this really is Nissan's first attempt and first model in the Full size realm. Considering the company isnt used to building full size trucks, I found the Titan to actually be quite an impressive truck.
I'd buy it over anything Ford, Chevy, and anything less then a Hemi powered Dodge. However, give them another 2 yrs or so, and I think they will be giving Dodge a great challenge AND great competition. Both Chevy and Ford have been owned by the Ram for the last 10 yrs in my personal opinion, so its nice to see a truck that could potentially push the Ram into even better places.
The Titan is overhyped, but its still the 2nd best truck you can buy in a gas powered motor.
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RE: Nissan Titan Secret Shopper - 12/11/2005 1:17:04 PM
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MGDMike
Posts: 4091
Joined: 8/17/2005
Status: offline
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Nice assessment!! Good to see somebody besides a magazine give an impression once in a while.
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RE: Nissan Titan Secret Shopper - 12/11/2005 1:27:16 PM
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HemiMan4451
Posts: 2624
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Maryland
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The Titan is a very nice truck. I think the rear seat room is the biggest thing that is better about them than our quadcabs. Their crew cabs have alot more space. If you get the LE package, you get leather and all the works. I think this is a very good attempt from nissan. They have a very hightech engine, and in crewcab form, it takes on the hemis. What is it, like a 5.6 DOHC v-8? They underate their horsepower too. I am very impressed with the Titan and it would be my second shoice for a truck.
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04'' Ram 1500 5.7L RCLB
-Flowmaster 40 series dual exhaust
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RE: Nissan Titan Secret Shopper - 12/14/2005 2:53:29 AM
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97 3.5 Intrepid
Posts: 1397
Joined: 9/30/2005
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Good review. I'm not a fan of Nissans interior either. I have a aunt that has an Altima that is a year old, and the leather looks like it is five years old. It is not aging well. It look great new, but not anymore.
HemiMann4451, the Mega Cab makes up for the difference.
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RE: Nissan Titan Secret Shopper - 12/15/2005 4:49:10 PM
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Spear_em
Posts: 358
Joined: 1/28/2005
From: Pleasant Hill, Ia
Status: offline
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I stopped in at a Nissan dealer the other day, and looked at it like you said (eventhough I've always thought it was Butt-Ugly in the first place; though I didnt test drive it). I opened the door to look at the interior and the leather and plastic reminded me of the interior in my wifes Chevy Tracker....Cheap, and flimsy! I dont care what anyone says especially DevilsReject; For a truck that is rated so high; I'd expect less flaws, and better interior material no matter if it is Nissan's first truck! I'd definetly take a FORD or a Chevy over this piece of crapola anyday!
< Message edited by Spear_em -- 12/15/2005 4:50:51 PM >
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RE: Nissan Titan Secret Shopper - 12/16/2005 8:57:19 PM
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thump186
Posts: 1758
Joined: 9/19/2004
Status: offline
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Very nice to see an honest opinion on it and not some magazine hype about it. I do have to agree with revils reject in saying give it time and nissan may well give um a run for thier money.
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RE: Nissan Titan Secret Shopper - 12/18/2005 8:52:32 AM
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homerun
Posts: 25
Joined: 5/30/2005
Status: offline
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And you guys call this an "honest opnion"? There was nothing objective about it. If the Dodge is such a great truck, why does CHevy and Ford outsell it. Why does Nissan out perform it. C'mon guys, write an honest review. I have yet to hear of wobbly door handles, or the Nissan emplbem metal coming off-that's pure BS!!
There's a reason why the Titan keeps winning awards, and the Dodge doesn't. You don't have to agree with the "experts", but there's a reason why they're experts and you're not. There's a reason why they pick the Titan over the Dodge and you don't-it's called BEING SMART!!
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RE: Nissan Titan Secret Shopper - 12/19/2005 6:54:27 AM
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HankL
Posts: 2719
Joined: 8/20/2005
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Competition is good.
Let's hope that Dodge responds to the Titan (and the Ridgeline) and meets some of their better features.
The Titan needs a better differential than the 'Super44' and the Ridgeline needs a longer bed.
Both the Titan and Ridgeline are more aerodynamic than the Ram so let's hope the engineers at DC are turned loose in the wind tunnel to match or better them.
The Titan's 5 speed automatic is impressive, and Dodge should re-double their efforts to offer reliable and high performance transmissions in the Ram...including a computer shifted manual like the DSG or SMT. DC should even consider swallowing its pride and buying a trans for the Ram from Jatco like they have for the new Dodge Nitro. (Jatco is a Nissan subsidary) Consider that BMW swallowed their pride and bought an engine for the Mini from a Dodge factory in Brazil.
All the pickups need to be made stronger, stiffer and lighter at the same time.
Ghosn recently said Nissan
"is an American company because that is where the majority of our profits are made"
and is moving Nissan headquarters to Nashville TN. (note this is a statement by a Brazilian born French citizen about a company founded in Japan whose stock is half owned by Renault and where Renault's stock is half owned by Nissan after Nissan bought it from the French government...go figure that spiderweb out)
Dieter Zetsche is a german born, german educated engineer & US Citizen who recently gave a farewell speech in Detroit where he said 'I will always be a Chrysler man' as he left to take over Mercedes. Zetsche had previously been president of Freightliner Trucks. His job is now to 'Americanize' the factories in Germany that can no longer compete on the global market.
Both GM and Ford are making slight profits overseas and losing money on sales inside the USA.
You can truthfully say that US citizens are propping up Mercedes and Nissan by buying their products - and that foreigners are propping up GM and Ford.
I won't say the world is changing for the better,
but the world is changing.
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RE: Nissan Titan Secret Shopper - 12/19/2005 5:44:24 PM
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homerun
Posts: 25
Joined: 5/30/2005
Status: offline
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Very good post Hank. I don't think Nissan needs a new rear end, but there's defintely an issue. I'm hoping it was a bad batch of gears that got put in.
I'm glad that someone understands that just because there's an American name on the car, doesn't necessarily make it American. Just as foreign doesn't necessarily mean it's foriegn made.
As for the Ridgeline, that thing is hideous, and I know people here don't like the Titan, but please NEVER put the Ridgeline in the same class as the Titan!
BTW-Ridgeline is having a few isses, but none bigger than this one...
http://www.ridgelineownersclub.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3580&page=11
I hope it's okay to post a link.
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RE: Nissan Titan Secret Shopper - 12/20/2005 12:04:01 AM
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Spear_em
Posts: 358
Joined: 1/28/2005
From: Pleasant Hill, Ia
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: homerun
"I'm glad that someone understands that just because there's an American name on the car, doesn't necessarily make it American. Just as foreign doesn't necessarily mean it's foriegn made.
As for the Ridgeline, that thing is hideous, and I know people here don't like the Titan, but please NEVER put the Ridgeline in the same class as the Titan!"
Ok, the Dodge will always be American in my book, and just because a Jap car is assembled here; doesnt make it American...the company is still headquartered in Japan; and a good percentage of the $$$$$$$ goes over to Japan.
I will categorize the fugly Ridgeline with the fugly Titan anytime I want; because I believe in equality, and these two so called "Trucks" are EQUALLY FUGLY!
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RE: Nissan Titan Secret Shopper - 12/20/2005 10:39:50 PM
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sandiegohemi
Posts: 411
Joined: 5/23/2005
From: San Diego, CA
Status: offline
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Okay, if you don't think what I posted was "honest" it is only because you disagree with it. I gave Nissan credit for the things it did well - engine, transmission (even though it is borrowed from the 350Z, just beefed up), and innovations. And, I called out their blatant weakness - quality and refinement.
Secondly, to say my truck "sucks" because it is outsold by Ford and Chevy is kinda funny. Because what does it say that YOUR truck is outsold by the F150, Silverado, Ram, Sierra, Tundra, Tacoma, Colorado, and Dakota??? See this link http://www.pickuptruck.com/html/otf0999.html Note the sales for September 2004 and 2005 for the Titan, they have actually sold 900 LESS than the first year it came out. You'd think if the Titan was the greatest thing since sliced bread, they'd sell more than the first year. So, when Nissan can sell more trucks a year than a DAKOTA, then come back with the sales argument. In which case, I'll tell you to come back when it sells more trucks than a Ranger . . . or Colorado . . . or Tacoma . . . you get the point.
Next, I wouldn't define being "smart" as buying a truck with known brake and rear end problems. I would encourage you to look at these two websites -
1) www.nissantitanbrakeproblems.com
2) www.lemonlawcenter.com/brake-problems.htm
I thought it was funny someone created a website called "NissanTitanBrakeProblems.com" Nothing quite says epidemic like a website name dedicated to it! Plus, I came across this ABSOLUTELY GOLDEN POST on Titantalk.com - www.titantalk.com/forums/titan-problems-dealer-service/28595-titan-frame-problem.html I couldn't have made this up if I tried. But it looks like Titan owners have a problem with their trucks being crooked . . . too funny.
As for performance, check out this 2006 half ton truck review from TruckTrend, specifically pages 9 and 10 which list 0-60 and 1/4 mile times for the Hemi Ram and Titan -
http://trucktrend.com/roadtests/pickup/163_0512_4doorfaceoff/index8.html
0-60 time Titan 7.6 seconds, Ram 7.7 seconds
1/4 mile Ram 15.6 seconds, Titan 15.6 seconds
Looks pretty even to me, so I'd say your performance "advantage" is zero to none. Now, I know you Titan guys are going to talk crap about that tenth of a second, so I would say check out what the tested Ram has on it - 20" rims compared to the 18" for the Titan. Put 18" rims on the Ram, and we are even in acceleration.
Lastly, you can dismiss the fact I noticed quality failures as "BS" but I see it as a real problem. If the things I see first in a truck - handles, interior, and trim - are this cheap, what else did they go cheap on? Plus, the Titan may be able to tow 9,500 lbs but I'd love to see them tow it 40-50 miles. Because, if their trim and seats break after 200 miles, what is the transmission, axle, brakes, etc going to do when put to the test? That is something I'd pay money to see - so if any of you Titan owners plan on towing something over 8,000 lbs, let me know and I'll pay my own way to see you do it.
< Message edited by sandiegohemi -- 12/20/2005 10:49:28 PM >
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RE: Nissan Titan Secret Shopper - 12/22/2005 8:16:22 AM
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homerun
Posts: 25
Joined: 5/30/2005
Status: offline
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Well, I know there have been some who have towed OVER 8,000lbs, but I wouldn't do that. If someone needs to tow that much, I'd get a 3/4 ton.
As for the Titan outselling any American truck-that'll never happen, and that's okay. It doesn't have to sell the most, to be the best. Look at the article you got your info from-the Truck Trend shootout. You forgot to mention that the Titan won that once again! Two years in it, two years winning it!! I'd say that's a pretty good track record.
As for reliability issues. The Titan is not bad as the internet would have you to believe. To date, there's only been two recalls. It's still a new truck and bugs have to be worked out. The brake issue has been resolved. The rear end issue will be resolved too. How long did it take Dodge to work out the bugs in the Ram? I think they're still trying. Just read the board here-cracked dashes, tranny problems...the list goes on and on. No truck is without problems, NO TRUCK-Fords, caught fire, Toyota, front brake problems (same as Titan), plus they just had the largest safety recall, Checvy, well, theyr'e Chevy-thigns always break, and Dodge-tranny problems for years. But the Titan is taking more verbal abuse than any other, but I'm nto sure why?
And let's talk about performance-THe Hemi motor has lots of HP. As a matter of fact, it has 40 more than the Titan. But why is it that the same conifgured truck, QC vs. CC, the Hemi is slower? Why is it that Hemi is rated at only 7,600lbs. and the Titan is at 9,400? THe Hemi has helped Dodge tremendously, but let's face it, it's a HUGE marketing scheme. One that's worked, but in the end, the drivetrain is not that impressive. Why is it that a stock Hemi with 345hp is dyno's around 250? Why is it stock Titans dyno around 265-275?
By the way...Happy Holidays!!!
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RE: Nissan Titan Secret Shopper - 12/22/2005 11:59:36 AM
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sandiegohemi
Posts: 411
Joined: 5/23/2005
From: San Diego, CA
Status: offline
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I am not sure where you got the dyno numbers from. Take a look at these dyno runs - I am just comparing the STOCK HP numbers, not what the muffler companies are saying their systems produce -
Aeroturbine Exhaust - http://www.aero-turbine.com/seehear/seehear.cgi?search=y
You have to search "Dodge" and "truck" but it shows STOCK HP @ 275 HP.
Magnaflow - http://www.magnaflow.com/newdyno.asp
This shows a Hemi around 268 STOCK HP, and the Titan around 252 STOCK HP. So again, I'm not sure where you get this "Titan 275 hp and Hemi 250."
Secondly, the reason a Titan is quick is because of its gearing. It has shorter gears than a Dodge, which is why you see the 0-60 and 1/4 mile times so close. Thirdly, the reason a Titan is rated at 9400 and a Ram at 8500 (for a QC Hemi, not sure where you got the 7600 from), is because of a lot of factors (gearing, torque curve, and mostly marketing). But like you said, if you are going to tow anything over 8,000 lbs, you should use a 3/4 ton. I agree, so whether a truck tows 8500 or 9400 or 9900, it doesn't really matter. However, if a Titan owner is going to tell me their truck is better because it "supposedly" tows 9400 lbs, I wanna see it : )
As for the article, you said the Titan won again - it didn't win an award, merely the opinion of the editors. But you also have to realize TruckTrend rated the Tundra #2 (a complete joke), and by the way, gave the Honda Ridgeline the 2006 Truck of Year award (another joke). The Nissan Titan NEVER WON the Truck of the Year award - in 2004 it was beaten by the F150, 2005 by the Toyota Tacoma, and 2006 by the Honda Ridgeline. That is 0-3 to me. I was merely quoting them to show the performance numbers, which are even between a Titan and Ram.
You are right, every vehicle has problems. I let the Titan and F150 slide in their first year of vehicles. But once you are into production year 2 or 3, and people are having the same problems, then it throws up a red flag. Plus, what did you think about the link I posted for Titantalk.com - about the crooked Titan frames? : )
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